Black and single: Is marriage really for white people?

[TheHipHopBillGates]

A career she enjoyed, a nice home, two adorable children and a husband. She shared her tools for success with me at an early age. She went to college, got married and waited until she was 26 to have her first child.

The perfect life. The perfect plan. It was one I decided to model.

My aspirations for both a career and family were set at the age of 12. I knew I could accomplish what Mrs. Allen, my fifth- and seventh-grade teacher, had. But as I approach 30 and measure the goals I had at 12 against the reality of life, the only thing I can check off that list is a college education.

I am a statistic.

And there are millions more like me. Forty-five percent of black women in America have never been married, compared with 23 percent of white women, according to the U.S. Census Bureau's American Community Survey in 2006. Articles like the one published in the Washington Post two years ago could lead me to believe that it's because "Marriage is for White People." Black men respond about love and families »

The difference between Mrs. Allen and me: She was white.

The numbers, undeniably, are not in my favor. But they have never been. Born black, raised in a single-parent home and primarily educated in low-performing public schools, I am not supposed to be a success story. But giving weight to statistics in my personal life only contributes to a culture of fear surrounding marriage.

This fear causes some women to make hasty decisions like staying in unfulfilling relationships that lead to unsuccessful marriages, which end in divorce (another dismal statistic). Or just the opposite: Women become so fearful of making the wrong choice, they find themselves surrounded by a moat with no bridge to their final destination: marriage.

For the past year, I have researched, read and conducted several interviews on this topic for the "Black in America" series. Producing a segment on the low marriage rates in black America was not without its challenges.

I wore my "black and single" crown proudly, withstanding jokes and heckles from coworkers and questions from fellow singles like Kriss Turner, a black woman profiled for the "Black Woman & Family" documentary who asked me, "You're in Atlanta; what's your problem?"

Why are you still single? I hate that question. Yet I am forced to confront it. What's the state of your relationship?

One reason: personal responsibility. Among the men I have dated, there were definitely some who were ready for something a little more significant than I was willing to give. Did I drag my feet because I wasn't ready? Or was it because those men weren't right for me? It's debatable and probably a combination of the two.

Mrs. Allen was white, but she was also part of a generation of people, like my parents, who married at an earlier age. Today, black women outnumber black men almost 2-to-1 in higher education. But white women are also surpassing white men in college enrollment and completion, according to the National Center on Education Statistics.

What is a rooted example in the black community is also sprouting legs among America's other racial groups. I am part of a generation of Americans who are choosing to postpone marriage while they pursue their careers.

My outlook: optimistic. My honest fear: It may never happen.

If it doesn't happen, it won't be because of a widening gap in the education, employment and ambitions of black men and women. I will not attribute it to a lack of options, intra- or interracially. I know the numbers.

On a macro level, the horizon is grim, but my personal experience reflects stories of black women and men who are married or very seriously considering it. Social and economic conditions are very strong influences, but so is the desire for love.

If I remain in my current statistical category, a single black woman, it will be because I missed someone while gazing at the ancient obelisks of Egypt's Karnak Temple, partying with expats in Hong Kong or simply spending time with family and friends in America.

It's more likely that the proverbial "The One" and I will find each other somewhere along the way. My life is not lived on a timetable or measured by how much sand has fallen in an hourglass.

So check back in with me in 2018. I may have a different story to share

http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/wayoflife/07/22/single.black.women/index.html

[jameznyhc]

thank white liberalsd for destroying the african american family .. why the man gonna bring home the bacon when a pregnant young black woman can get uncle same to not only bring home the bacon ..but give her an apartment and healthcare?? ..if you notice this problem does not exist in jamaican and haitian black americans

[JustLikeHeaven]

thank white liberalsd for destroying the african american family .. why the man gonna bring home the bacon when a pregnant young black woman can get uncle same to not only bring home the bacon ..but give her an apartment and healthcare?? ..if you notice this problem does not exist in jamaican and haitian black americans

Yea just blame it all on liberals :yourcrazy

White liberals destroyed the African American family?? LMAO. But yet if that young black woman was out on the streets cause she wasn't getting welfare or healthcare I suppose liberals would be to blame for that also, right? Or u think that would be a better scenario?

[JustLikeHeaven]

BTW - married w/first child at 26 = perfect life?
I am scared. LOL

[jameznyhc]

Yea just blame it all on liberals :yourcrazy

White liberals destroyed the African American family?? LMAO. But yet if that young black woman was out on the streets cause she wasn't getting welfare or healthcare I suppose liberals would be to blame for that also, right? Or u think that would be a better scenario?

why would she be on the streets ..are you saying black people are lazy?? shame on you!!

[JustLikeHeaven]

why would she be on the streets ..are you saying black people are lazy?? shame on you!!

Don't play yourself lmao
U know what I'm saying !!!

[jameznyhc]

Don't play yourself lmao
U know what I'm saying !!!

no please tell me .. im not sure at all??

[TheHipHopBillGates]

why would she be on the streets ..are you saying black people are lazy?? shame on you!!

no more then you blamed white liberals for making black men lazy, shame on you also. Is it possible to you to reply to any post without some type of left targeted propaganda?

[JustLikeHeaven]

no please tell me .. im not sure at all??

If I must spell it out for u...

YOU presented a situation about a young, black woman who is getting gov't support, suggesting that because of WHITE LIBERALS she is somehow deterred from finding an able black man to take care of her...

SO not only did u imply that black men are LAZY u also implied that black women NEED a man to take care of them...Shame on YOU!

[JustLikeHeaven]

no more then you blamed white liberals for making black men lazy, shame on you also. Is it possible to you to reply to any post without some type of left targeted propaganda?

lol exactly!!!

[jameznyhc]

no more then you blamed white liberals for making black men lazy, shame on you also. Is it possible to you to reply to any post without some type of left targeted propaganda?

where did i say the left made black men lazy??..I said they destroyed the african american family by throwing free money housing and healthcare .. that way the black man has no reason to go bring home the bacon ..

[jameznyhc]

lol exactly!!!

i did where did i say that??

[chris817]

where did i say the left made black men lazy??..I said they destroyed the african american family by throwing free money housing and healthcare .. that way the black man has no reason to go bring home the bacon ..

no reason? how about getting out of the ghetto? having some selfrespect to not be dependent on the govt
no reason to work is implying they are lazy

[metfan85]

Yea just blame it all on liberals :yourcrazy

White liberals destroyed the African American family?? LMAO. But yet if that young black woman was out on the streets cause she wasn't getting welfare or healthcare I suppose liberals would be to blame for that also, right? Or u think that would be a better scenario?

What he's referring to is the LBJ Great Society policies. The original New Deal program, Aid to Families with Dependent Children (AFDC) was supposed to give money only to widowed women with children. In the 1960's that was changed by LBJ to include all households where there was no male present. Regardless of circumstance, widowed, divorce wedlock. This now made it more lucrative to not have a male in the household.

In 1950 88% of white families and 78% of black families were married. 12 years after the signing of the new welfare laws, whites were married at an 85% rate and black marriage plummeted to 54%.

In this 20 years period single parent white poor increased by 50%, while single family black poor increased 200% from under 30% to 70% of the population.



there's no link to this I had done research on this...
Charles Murray "Losing Ground, America's Social policy 1950- 1980" and Fagan and Rector "The effects of Divorce in America"

[JustLikeHeaven]

no reason? how about getting out of the ghetto? having some selfrespect to not be dependent on the govt
no reason to work is implying they are lazy

Precisely

[JustLikeHeaven]

What he's referring to is the LBJ Great Society policies. The original New Deal program, Aid to Families with Dependent Children (AFDC) was supposed to give money only to widowed women with children. In the 1960's that was changed by LBJ to include all households where there was no male present. Regardless of circumstance, widowed, divorce wedlock. This now made it more lucrative to not have a male in the household.

In 1950 88% of white families and 78% of black families were married. 12 years after the signing of the new welfare laws, whites were married at an 85% rate and black marriage plummeted to 54%.

In this 20 years period single parent white poor increased by 50%, while single family black poor increased 200% from under 30% to 70% of the population.



there's no link to this I had done research on this...
Charles Murray "Losing Ground, America's Social policy 1950- 1980" and Fagan and Rector "The effects of Divorce in America"

LOL I read that book for one of my classes as well (well, more like footnotes/summary of it lol)

And let's call it what it is, he was clearly calling them lazy...Saying that someone will just sit on their ass and wait for everything to be handed to them is calling them LAZY. And he was calling white libs the "enablers."

Regardless of the programs u mentioned, if someone truly wants to be productive they will do better for themselves and not rely solely on gov't assistance. Implying that they have no desire to do so = calling them LAZY.

[jameznyhc]

no reason? how about getting out of the ghetto? having some selfrespect to not be dependent on the govt
no reason to work is implying they are lazy

that there lazy?? or provided for?? huge difference kid .. why leave the ghetto when you get everything for free ?? thats the type of entrapment im talking about ..

[JustLikeHeaven]

that there lazy?? or provided for?? huge difference kid .. why leave the ghetto when you get everything for free ?? thats the type of entrapment im talking about ..

maybe cause u want something better?!???! And you're willing to work for it?

[jameznyhc]

LOL I read that book for one of my classes as well (well, more like footnotes/summary of it lol)

And let's call it what it is, he was clearly calling them lazy...Saying that someone will just sit on their ass and wait for everything to be handed to them is calling them LAZY. And he was calling white libs the "enablers."

Regardless of the programs u mentioned, if someone truly wants to be productive they will do better for themselves and not rely solely on gov't assistance. Implying that they have no desire to do so = calling them LAZY.

being providedf for will not make someone lazy ..only you can choose that .. it goes back to the 30 yr old guy ..if she kicked him out id bet he would find work or try too .. since she providing for him he has no reason too ..ahh now you get it??

why is this problem so bad among african americans i gave you my theory .. lets hear yours ..

[jameznyhc]

maybe cause u want something better?!???! And you're willing to work for it?

my point is you can survive on the basics .. when your providede for it inhibits motivation , drive , and education ... and there are those who do work there way ourt of the ghetto but they aint on welfare being irrsponsible

[metfan85]

LOL I read that book for one of my classes as well (well, more like footnotes/summary of it lol)

And let's call it what it is, he was clearly calling them lazy...Saying that someone will just sit on their ass and wait for everything to be handed to them is calling them LAZY. And he was calling white libs the "enablers."

Regardless of the programs u mentioned, if someone truly wants to be productive they will do better for themselves and not rely solely on gov't assistance. Implying that they have no desire to do so = calling them LAZY.

haha looks like QC library only has 1 book lol...

in a lot of cases it was more profitable to be a signle out of work mother with children

[chris817]

that there lazy?? or provided for?? huge difference kid .. why leave the ghetto when you get everything for free ?? thats the type of entrapment im talking about ..

your making it seem like the ghetto is club med.. go visit one see if you would live there for free
who can forget about the gov't cheese.. yummie

[jameznyhc]

your making it seem like the ghetto is club med.. go visit one see if you would live there for free
who can forget about the gov't cheese.. yummie

compared to other places in the world is absolutly is .. thats why jamiacans and haitians have such a sick work ethic ..

did you forget we only been modernized for 100 years or so .. georgwe washington shit in outhouses lol

[chris817]

compared to other places in the world is absolutly is .. thats why jamiacans and haitians have such a sick work ethic ..

did you forget we only been modernized for 100 years or so .. georgwe washington shit in outhouses lol
you cant be serious with this answer

[jameznyhc]

you cant be serious with this answer

im dead serious .. ever been to a third world country?? ever read about nyc lower east side tenemants ?? ..bro when you have heat, water, shelter, cable, your living like a fuckin king ..you realize in heat waves in europe in france people were dying left and right ..No fuckin a/c in that country.. this is modern europe bro ..

[ShaE]

Yea just blame it all on liberals :yourcrazy

White liberals destroyed the African American family?? LMAO. But yet if that young black woman was out on the streets cause she wasn't getting welfare or healthcare I suppose liberals would be to blame for that also, right? Or u think that would be a better scenario?
i don't think he's physically capable of beginning a post that does not include a blanket statement involving liberals.

i could say the sky is blue, jamez would say it's b/c of the liberals.

[ShaE]

no reason? how about getting out of the ghetto? having some selfrespect to not be dependent on the govt
no reason to work is implying they are lazy
yeah really, saying "no reason" means you think the single motivator for working and making money is to support your family, not b/c you are a driven person who feels an obligation to work to support THEMSELVES and do something other than sit on their ass.

saying giving people free basics takes away their drive to work, implies they have no character and no drive to do anything with their lives.

[ShaE]

Regardless of the programs u mentioned, if someone truly wants to be productive they will do better for themselves and not rely solely on gov't assistance. Implying that they have no desire to do so = calling them LAZY.
Right, like a person could have no other motivation for making something of his life than the need to eat/have shelter. If those needs are taken care of from doing nothing, he'd be content to sit around, eat chee-tos and watch talk shows for his lifetime :rolleyes:

[ShaE]

compared to other places in the world is absolutly is ..
have these black people you're referring to lived in these other places of the world? have they felt how much worse it could be? no.

so then it's irrelevant.

[jameznyhc]

[QUOTE]yeah really, saying "no reason" means you think the single motivator for working and making money is to support your family, not b/c you are a driven person who feels an obligation to work to support THEMSELVES and do something other than sit on their ass.

people like this leave the ghetto



saying giving people free basics takes away their drive to work, implies they have no character and no drive to do anything with their lives

Unfortunatly an unintended consequence when you feed, clothe, house, and provide healthcare for someone .. i not only takes away drive and motivation .. it creates medicrity and low self esteem

[Benny B]

your making it seem like the ghetto is club med.. go visit one see if you would live there for free
who can forget about the gov't cheese.. yummie

and do you ever ask yourself why the houses are in that condition???? maybe because... i dunno they didnt pay for it???? when people are paying for something they take care of things..

[ShaE]

Unfortunatly an unintended consequence when you feed, clothe, house, and provide healthcare for someone .. i not only takes away drive and motivation .. it creates medicrity and low self esteem

Really, so my parents took away my drive and motivation by providing for me? lol

[chris817]

and do you ever ask yourself why the houses are in that condition???? maybe because... i dunno they didnt pay for it???? when people are paying for something they take care of things..

so your saying bc its free they have no sense of pride? and are content livin in those conditions

[metfan85]

so your saying bc its free they have no sense of pride? and are content livin in those conditions

of course people are content to live in those places. i work non-union construction a lot of people I come across are not only content but happy there getting it for free. One particular guy lived in Queensbridge paying 250 a month and was estatic

[ShaE]

I do agree that people tend to be more careful with and value things more when they're spent their hard earned money on them, but that doesn't mean people are careless with or content with things that have been given to them or made more accessible to them.

Just because someone would take care of a house they bought better, doesn't mean they're content living in the projects for cheap and don't care about the condition of their living space. yea, great, it's cheap and they have someplace to stay, but you think that makes up for the misery of living in a dump? people always want nicer things, more comforts, you think they let their place languish b/c they didn't have to buy it? they LIVE in it.

[ShaE]

of course people are content to live in those places. i work non-union construction a lot of people I come across are not only content but happy there getting it for free. One particular guy lived in Queensbridge paying 250 a month and was estatic
yeah and some people are content to live in trailer parks, I wouldn't propose it's the vast majority of the lower class that's "content" with their living situation.

[darius]

let's just hurry up and get the black man into the white house so whitey can pay

[chris817]

of course people are content to live in those places. i work non-union construction a lot of people I come across are not only content but happy there getting it for free. One particular guy lived in Queensbridge paying 250 a month and was estatic

im not a fool, i understand some people would live anywhere.. But a majority are not happy living there and want something better.. original argument was bc of liberals its breeded this mentality

[jameznyhc]

im not a fool, i understand some people would live anywhere.. But a majority are not happy living there and want something better.. original argument was bc of liberals its breeded this mentality

because african americans have been stuck in the ghetto way longer than when the irash, german, jewish, italian, and hispanic communties ...jamaicans and haitians dont have anywhere near the fatherless rate of african american children ..

You look at muslims in europe compare them to muslims in america ... In europe they are the ones stuck in slums..

You look at europe been around for centuries longer than us ..in 200 years ( ablink of an eye) weve surpassed them in every aspect of life from medicine, cures, inventions, technology, etc ..there is a reason ..when goverment provides people do loose drive ... Honestly if your boss said you have one week to be more effective or im firing you ..do you think you'll be motivated and driven to be alot more effective??..

[ShaE]

im not a fool, i understand some people would live anywhere.. But a majority are not happy living there and want something better.. original argument was bc of liberals its breeded this mentality
you can't MAKE somebody feel a certain way about themselves, they allow you to. liberals can't make blacks lazy and unmotivated by "providing" for them through programs. if the blacks are lazy and unmotivated, it's because they ALLOWED themselves to become that way as a result of the necessities they were being handed. don't tell me they've ceased to think because of liberal policies. no doubt the policies enable complacency, and contribute to it, but to blame it entirely for the mindset some people have is bullshit.

that's like saying if i grow up spoiled by my parents and become a raving bitch, I'm not responsible for it b/c their actions caused it. no, I still am, and I could choose to accept their generosity while still feeling grateful and motivated to do for myself.

giving doesn't have to enable laziness and complacency, the people choose to become that way instead of taking the help, and using it to better their situation, which is what the original intent was. laziness isn't the fault of those enacting the policy, but of the people accepting the help.

[Benny B]

because african americans have been stuck in the ghetto way longer than when the irash, german, jewish, italian, and hispanic communties ...jamaicans and haitians dont have anywhere near the fatherless rate of african american children ..

You look at muslims in europe compare them to muslims in america ... In europe they are the ones stuck in slums..

You look at europe been around for centuries longer than us ..in 200 years ( ablink of an eye) weve surpassed them in every aspect of life from medicine, cures, inventions, technology, etc ..there is a reason ..when goverment provides people do loose drive ... Honestly if your boss said you have one week to be more effective or im firing you ..do you think you'll be motivated and driven to be alot more effective??..

who knew we had a country of people with skin problems..

:chuckle

[ShaE]

You look at muslims in europe compare them to muslims in america ... In europe they are the ones stuck in slums..


they are vastly different because the economic opportunities for muslims here are much greater. if you give people the opportunity to work, support their families, and live somewhat comfortably in society you'll find they aren't miserable hostile people.

in europe the discrimination and isolation towards muslims is much greater, this makes them angrier, more volatile and less productive. they're stuck in slums b/c that's what they can afford or where they're socially confined to.

[jameznyhc]

they are vastly different because the economic opportunities for muslims here are much greater. if you give people the opportunity to work, support their families, and live somewhat comfortably in society you'll find they aren't miserable hostile people.

in europe the discrimination and isolation towards muslims is much greater, this makes them angrier, more volatile and less productive. they're stuck in slums b/c that's what they can afford or where they're socially confined to.

ok with affirmitive action and quotas favoring african americans why hasent the same principle you claim (opppurtunity, growth, etc??) .. happened?? ..i say because of handouts.. and entitlements ..

[ShaE]

ok with affirmitive action and quotas favoring african americans why hasent the same principle you claim (opppurtunity, growth, etc??) .. happened?? ..i say because of handouts.. and entitlements ..
do you seriously think affirmative action is like the silver bullet of prosperity or something? like b/c of it every african american w/ half a brain can get an ideal job and enjoy a comfy lifestyle? these are BAND AIDS, meek attempts at trying to help african americans compensate for the disadvantages WHITES imposed on them by impeding their education for centuries, impeding their participation in gov't, obstructing their presence in the skilled workforce, educational facilities, you name it. it's not a CURE ALL for all of that. Fifty years ago they were still getting lynched for christ sakes jamez and you act like this gov't program should've ended all their troubles and they should be a-ok?

Living in that place in society, as inferior, with inferior opportunities, education, work, and status affects a population. Like I said handouts can create environments where people allow themselves to be lazy, our previous treatment of blacks created an environment that allowed them to be irresponsible, materialistic, criminal, uninterested in education, reliant on the gov't, unmotivated, you name it. not ALL obviously, but the anger they feel, justified to tell you the truth, can hold them back.

the support structure of their families is non existent, most of their young men are dead or in jail, most of the women are single mothers or unmarried, most do not achieve higher education, these are not elements that foster opportunity and growth. now granted, they are responsible for not doing more with their opportunities now, but I can also understand how they've fallen into the social and economic traps they have and are struggling to deal with that now.

you can't just expect something like affirmative action to come along and solve a whole race's problems in this country.

[jameznyhc]

do you seriously think affirmative action is like the silver bullet of prosperity or something? like b/c of it every african american w/ half a brain can get an ideal job and enjoy a comfy lifestyle? these are BAND AIDS, meek attempts at trying to help african americans compensate for the disadvantages WHITES imposed on them by impeding their education for centuries, impeding their participation in gov't, obstructing their presence in the skilled workforce, educational facilities, you name it. it's not a CURE ALL for all of that. Fifty years ago they were still getting lynched for christ sakes jamez and you act like this gov't program should've ended all their troubles and they should be a-ok?

Living in that place in society, as inferior, with inferior opportunities, education, work, and status affects a population. Like I said handouts can create environments where people allow themselves to be lazy, our previous treatment of blacks created an environment that allowed them to be irresponsible, materialistic, criminal, uninterested in education, reliant on the gov't, unmotivated, you name it. not ALL obviously, but the anger they feel, justified to tell you the truth, can hold them back.

the support structure of their families is non existent, most of their young men are dead or in jail, most of the women are single mothers or unmarried, most do not achieve higher education, these are not elements that foster opportunity and growth. now granted, they are responsible for not doing more with their opportunities now, but I can also understand how they've fallen into the social and economic traps they have and are struggling to deal with that now.

you can't just expect something like affirmative action to come along and solve a whole race's problems in this country.

Right and alot of those problems you mentioned can be traced to LBJ liberal policy destroying the african american family as i pointed out ... Shae i know your not this liberal ..not even you ..so research fatherless african american households before the 60s ..look at crime rate and drug addiction (mind you this is before civil rights, anti profiling, and people were blatantly racist ) ..African americans were not killing each other, poising kids with crack, praising hoods, ..sorry i see regression in those liberal policies ..Compare them to present day caribbean and african black families migrating here ..no fuckin comparison ...why???

[drumaboy]

Right and alot of those problems you mentioned can be traced to LBJ liberal policy destroying the african american family as i pointed out ... Shae i know your not this liberal ..not even you ..so research fatherless african american households before the 60s ..look at crime rate and drug addiction (mind you this is before civil rights, anti profiling, and people were blatantly racist ) ..African americans were not killing each other, poising kids with crack, praising hoods, ..sorry i see regression in those liberal policies ..Compare them to present day caribbean and african black families migrating here ..no fuckin comparison ...why???

more talk from the mind that doesn't know.......


uhm, afro-amer family was destroyed starting day one of slavery NOT from LBJ's policy.........then you jump from pre-60's to mid-80's......making a case when blacks were "good", as if to say they were prosperous, economically and socially, back then, riiiight...........and then you compare them to preset day FAMILIES migrating, you're obviously blind to the core problem which is the lack of a centered family, any immigrant family coming over pales in comparison to a single, family on welfare here....apples and oranges........and while you're comparing the caribbeans and africans, sorry bud, they're in the ghetto, too....not getting as near in prosperity as other immigrant groups

james, a lil tip.....end your racist statements while youre at it, and i know that gets you all flustered, but see, your comments, your assanine statistical nonsense, your "bringin home the bacon"....your lack of statistics on non-blacks on welfare.....just keeps proving why you fear Obama's victory :heythere

[metfan85]

more talk from the mind that doesn't know.......


uhm, afro-amer family was destroyed starting day one of slavery NOT from LBJ's policy.........then you jump from pre-60's to mid-80's......making a case when blacks were "good", as if to say they were prosperous, economically and socially, back then, riiiight...........and then you compare them to preset day FAMILIES migrating, you're obviously blind to the core problem which is the lack of a centered family, any immigrant family coming over pales in comparison to a single, family on welfare here....apples and oranges........and while you're comparing the caribbeans and africans, sorry bud, they're in the ghetto, too....not getting as near in prosperity as other immigrant groups

james, a lil tip.....end your racist statements while youre at it, and i know that gets you all flustered, but see, your comments, your assanine statistical nonsense, your "bringin home the bacon"....your lack of statistics on non-blacks on welfare.....just keeps proving why you fear Obama's victory :heythere

lil tip think dont feel when forming your opinions ;)

black families did exist even in slavery, how do you think the black population continued to prosper after the slave trade was ended in 1807

[jameznyhc]

more talk from the mind that doesn't know.......


uhm, afro-amer family was destroyed starting day one of slavery NOT from LBJ's policy.........then you jump from pre-60's to mid-80's......making a case when blacks were "good", as if to say they were prosperous, economically and socially, back then, riiiight...........and then you compare them to preset day FAMILIES migrating, you're obviously blind to the core problem which is the lack of a centered family, any immigrant family coming over pales in comparison to a single, family on welfare here....apples and oranges........and while you're comparing the caribbeans and africans, sorry bud, they're in the ghetto, too....not getting as near in prosperity as other immigrant groups

james, a lil tip.....end your racist statements while youre at it, and i know that gets you all flustered, but see, your comments, your assanine statistical nonsense, your "bringin home the bacon"....your lack of statistics on non-blacks on welfare.....just keeps proving why you fear Obama's victory :heythere

shows me stats ..pre 1960 ..

As for an Obama presidency the man has changed his position to agree with me ... workfare not welfare son ..

Look at most middleclass black homeowners.. 2 parent family

you calling me racist definitly doesnt get me flustered you look stupid.. because i want to see them help themslves by teaching them skills to move from welfare.. remember rudy 1.2 million welfare recipients when he entered office ...360k when he left

Newsflash even bill clinton and now obama agree with me ..thats how regressive you are..very hypocritical for such an avid ann rand worshipper

[jameznyhc]

lil tip think dont feel when forming your opinions ;)

black families did exist even in slavery, how do you think the black population continued to prosper after the slave trade was ended in 1807

lol slavery existed for thousands of years before america was even discovered...still goes on today ..he such a simpleton maybe he never learned this..if he had a real substancial argument he wouldnt throw the liberal tactic of using the R word to discredit.. lol

[Chris]

thank white liberalsd for destroying the african american family .. why the man gonna bring home the bacon when a pregnant young black woman can get uncle same to not only bring home the bacon ..but give her an apartment and healthcare?? ..if you notice this problem does not exist in jamaican and haitian black americans

white liberals killed the African American family?

no it had nothing to do with the crackers that stole them from africa brought them here as slaves, forced them to work in fields, raped and killed the women, segregated the statesa for years.. nothing like that ..
oh wait and funny it should be those SAME States that vote republican each year. backward cracker ass pencil dicks who made the black people hate their own skin....

im sure giving them health care is ruining the black family. Sometimes you say the fucking dumbest dumbshit things on the planet really.

nothing to do with the fact that we BRED black people thru blood lines for the soul purpose of working in the fields, nothing to do with the fact that they couldn't even drink from the same water fountain, or sit on the same bus. you say slavery has been around for centuries well what country enslaves people as far as up until we did THAT blatantly. don't worry .... ill wait....

When you talk like this your inner bigot really shows thru. Liberals killeed the african american family, lets take a lilly pastey white person ohh i dont know like benny b, and stick him in harlem and let him say the liberals caused the african american family to deteriote, even with his ficticious guns and money he wouldn't make it out alive... not even an hour of survival...

nothing to do with the fact theirs a liqour store on every corner in the ghetto and 2 in a rich white neighborhood.... nothing to do with the fact that we BUS kids in from other areas to make it seem FAIR to our students. nothing to do with the total mindset people like you possess in this country that still sees a BLACK MAN running for office, rather than a well spoken smart articulate,,,,, Man....

ya liberals hung niggas, and raised confederate flags..
that sounds more like Benny B.. funny thing all that talk in real life that talk gets subsided when a 6 foot 4 black person comes around, then everyones all yo whatttttt uuppp soooonn... fucking corn balls.

[Chris]

lol slavery existed for thousands of years before america was even discovered...still goes on today ..he such a simpleton maybe he never learned this..if he had a real substancial argument he wouldnt throw the liberal tactic of using the R word to discredit.. lol

retarded.. slavery has been around since the dawn of time, BUT america made a corner of the market ....

do you own brain cells??? im curious

[Chris]

i ask every white person on this board to live for 1 week in a friends home in the ghetto.

IF you don't have a friends home to live in I would be kind enough to lend you a friend of mine. I want you to see the stark difference that goes on in your lilly white neighborhoods as opposed to darker ones. I am so sick of seeing people on this forum talk shit about which they know NOTHING about. its all lip service, all hear say, and all stuff they either read or was told NOT lived thru. please. I want people like

Benny, and Jamez to goto and spend time with ghetto people, go in a ghetto, go in a tenamant project housing, grow up around these people. funny thing i noticed about poor people they bond together more than their rich counterparts can ever ask for.... now please unles you been there. stfu...

[jameznyhc]

[QUOTE]white liberals killed the African American family?

Absolutly .. the govt became a provider not the father


no it had nothing to do with the crackers that stole them from africa brought them here as slaves, forced them to work in fields, raped and killed the women, segregated the statesa for years.. nothing like that ..
oh wait and funny it should be those SAME States that vote republican each year. backward cracker ass pencil dicks who made the black people hate their own skin....

Your wrong on 2 fronts .. first off slavery was thriving in africa as it does today correct?? .. and it was black slave master selling their own to racist despicable so called white americans ..the problem was your party wanted them enslaved ..my party freed them Abe Lincoln baby .. He knew it was a horrible injustice and despicable act he waged war .. do you know the history of draft riots where blacks were hung, massacred and killed by whites in nyc so angry because lincoln civil war to free them..my party allways been about freedom



im sure giving them health care is ruining the black family. Sometimes you say the fucking dumbest dumbshit things on the planet really.

it hasnt helped the death rate, hiv rate, etc is alot worse than whites who pay for their own ..medicare sucks cause govt has no clue thats why its a 10 billion deficit


nothing to do with the fact theirs a liqour store on every corner in the ghetto and 2 in a rich white neighborhood.... nothing to do with the fact that we BUS kids in from other areas to make it seem FAIR to our students. nothing to do with the total mindset people like you possess in this country that still sees a BLACK MAN running for office, rather than a well spoken smart articulate,,,,, Man....

there may be liquor store on every corner ..but theres also a crack dealers like biggie and tupac were who helped destroy their people ..both of them are dead due to the self destructiove mindset of thugs who kiill more african americans every year there very own brothers.. Lets look at white suburbia in nassau county white neighborhoods there is more bars per square mile than anywhere in the world ..I agree Obama great speaker but he is not black man he is bi-racial ..he half white


ya liberals hung niggas, and raised confederate flags..
that sounds more like Benny B..[/

I doubt benny likes the confederate flag considering it was republicans once again dying for peoples freedom we defeated the confederates.. we also passed the 1968 civil rights bill that racist southern dems opposed like gores father and robert kkk byrd .. :heythere

[jameznyhc]

i ask every white person on this board to live for 1 week in a friends home in the ghetto.

IF you don't have a friends home to live in I would be kind enough to lend you a friend of mine. I want you to see the stark difference that goes on in your lilly white neighborhoods as opposed to darker ones. I am so sick of seeing people on this forum talk shit about which they know NOTHING about. its all lip service, all hear say, and all stuff they either read or was told NOT lived thru. please. I want people like

Benny, and Jamez to goto and spend time with ghetto people, go in a ghetto, go in a tenamant project housing, grow up around these people. funny thing i noticed about poor people they bond together more than their rich counterparts can ever ask for.... now please unles you been there. stfu...


My grandparents lived in the ghetto called the south bronx dirt fuckin poor zero handouts during the depression ..my grandfather was so poor as a kid drew a picture of a christmas tree and put in on the refrigerator ..My grandfather resisted the temptaion of organized crime in his neighborhood due to his moral compass and compassion for his fellow neighbors ..he didnt take the easy way out like his cousins did made big bucks doing horrible things to his fellow citizens ..My grandfather dropped out at 13 to work in a pencil factory this was during the depression ..he taught me more about money than anyone i know..he worked his way up in a time when the irish, italians and jews were hated in this great country of ours .. but racists and bigots have allways existed ..my grandfather was a truman democrat who passed away as a reagan republican .. he was disgusted by socialism masquarading as liberalism .. he told me the blacks have no chance to progress without feeling the pain he and his italian, jewish, german, and puerto rican neighbors did ..he finally got out after he served in ww2 .. My parents werent loaded either but my dad was good with money he taught micro and macro economics..my dad grew up poor his side lived in a working class section of boston called sommerville lots of irish mobsters ..and crazy ass stories to be told my mom was your typical working class staten islander whose roots were in the bronx.. we lived off voctory blvd westerleigh/castleton corners.. i didnt know one kid who grew up on todt hill most staten islanders dont lol they had theyre own schools ..my best friend who you know personally spent one year at staten island academy and he was miserable .. he was far from rich and his poarents were struggling they escaped persecuted from russia ..you know who he is too ..but after they lived poor in brklyn, lower middle class on staten island ..they finally got their due from hard fucking work!! and moved to monmouth county NJ

I myself lived in every boro of this city (the exception of manhattan )..in the 80s and 90s i dont believe there is a ghetto i didnt spend time in due to my old drug habits unfortunatly..I was also allways hanging out when the lower east side was called alphabet city because i spent every weekend at cbgbs, and the pyramid club on ave A when i was in the nyhc scene ..and let me tell ya it was fuckin insane out there back then ..todfay the ghettos are nothing like it was when we were growing up thanks to rudy .. to this day i still go into ghettos while my co-workers think im nuts i have zero fear ..my advantage is most reps ignore the ghettos because theyre racist attitudes of blacks have no credit ..its bullshit ..20% of my base is flatbush, coney island, st albans, hollis, jamiaca etc ..i work with business in ghetto,..dont believe me ill give you references i work with companies on the upper east side and wall st as well .. this is why liberals are hypocrites ..i love helping companies save tremendous amounts of money ..one black guy i helped was wasting $1000 per mo on ink cartiridges .. i saved him $700 per month by offering a system thats better with toner included for for $399 ..dont believe me? i didnt think so ..ask your cousin or uncle who works for xerox he'll tell ya we do this all the time its called solution selling where integrity is the main principle to success ..tricks and manipulation is not tolerated

Ask people in the ghettos if there quality of life was better before rudy moved approximatly 600,000 people and gave them the skills to work... So where does this whole racism argument of yours come from??..as for lily white neighborhoods the only ones i lived in was staten island, marine park & bergen beach brooklyn ..after Bk i moved to queens first astoria, then lic now woodside ..im in a spanish and irish immigrant area i dont care my neighbors are cool as fuck and i got a 9 min commute to midtown on the lirr .. ill give up lily white hood for convience anyday .. now ya see how wrong you are due to your pre- judging?? prejudice is not good you claim to be against yet you totally subscribe to it as most white libs do

[Chris]

My grandparents lived in the ghetto called the south bronx dirt fuckin poor zero handouts during the depression ..my grandfather was so poor as a kid drew a picture of a christmas tree and put in on the refrigerator ..My grandfather resisted the temptaion of organized crime in his neighborhood due to his moral compass and compassion for his fellow neighbors ..he didnt take the easy way out like his cousins did made big bucks doing horrible things to his fellow citizens ..My grandfather dropped out at 13 to work in a pencil factory this was during the depression ..he taught me more about money than anyone i know..he worked his way up in a time when the irish, italians and jews were hated in this great country of ours .. but racists and bigots have allways existed ..my grandfather was a truman democrat who passed away as a reagan republican .. he was disgusted by socialism masquarading as liberalism .. he told me the blacks have no chance to progress without feeling the pain he and his italian, jewish, german, and puerto rican neighbors did ..he finally got out after he served in ww2 .. My parents werent loaded either but my dad was good with money he taught micro and macro economics..my dad grew up poor his side lived in a working class section of boston called sommerville lots of irish mobsters ..and crazy ass stories to be told my mom was your typical working class staten islander whose roots were in the bronx.. we lived off voctory blvd westerleigh/castleton corners.. i didnt know one kid who grew up on todt hill most staten islanders dont lol they had theyre own schools ..my best friend who you know personally spent one year at staten island academy and he was miserable .. he was far from rich and his poarents were struggling they escaped persecuted from russia ..you know who he is too ..but after they lived poor in brklyn, lower middle class on staten island ..they finally got their due from hard fucking work!! and moved to monmouth county NJ

I myself lived in every boro of this city (the exception of manhattan )..in the 80s and 90s i dont believe there is a ghetto i didnt spend time in due to my old drug habits unfortunatly..I was also allways hanging out when the lower east side was called alphabet city because i spent every weekend at cbgbs, and the pyramid club on ave A when i was in the nyhc scene ..and let me tell ya it was fuckin insane out there back then ..todfay the ghettos are nothing like it was when we were growing up thanks to rudy .. to this day i still go into ghettos while my co-workers think im nuts i have zero fear ..my advantage is most reps ignore the ghettos because theyre racist attitudes of blacks have no credit ..its bullshit ..20% of my base is flatbush, coney island, st albans, hollis, jamiaca etc ..i work with business in ghetto,..dont believe me ill give you references i work with companies on the upper east side and wall st as well .. this is why liberals are hypocrites ..i love helping companies save tremendous amounts of money ..one black guy i helped was wasting $1000 per mo on ink cartiridges .. i saved him $700 per month by offering a system thats better with toner included for for $399 ..dont believe me? i didnt think so ..ask your cousin or uncle who works for xerox he'll tell ya we do this all the time its called solution selling where integrity is the main principle to success ..tricks and manipulation is not tolerated

Ask people in the ghettos if there quality of life was better before rudy moved approximatly 600,000 people and gave them the skills to work... So where does this whole racism argument of yours come from??

your point here?

asking a black person if their life was better when rudy was in office?

lets not live in the past, even if it was it has zero bearing on today. Right?

why do you want to live in the past about everything? everything is a bring back to a time that was but guess what it aint.. so why even talk about it?

[Chris]

[QUOTE=Chris;2523449]

Absolutly .. the govt became a provider not the father



Your wrong on 2 fronts .. first off slavery was thriving in africa as it does today correct?? .. and it was black slave master selling their own to racist despicable so called white americans ..the problem was your party wanted them enslaved ..my party freed them Abe Lincoln baby .. He knew it was a horrible injustice and despicable act he waged war .. do you know the history of draft riots where blacks were hung, massacred and killed by whites in nyc so angry because lincoln civil war to free them..my party allways been about freedom


.

it hasnt helped the death rate, hiv rate, etc is alot worse than whites who pay for their own ..medicare sucks cause govt has no clue thats why its a 10 billion deficit



there may be liquor store on every corner ..but theres also a crack dealers like biggie and tupac were who helped destroy their people ..both of them are dead due to the self destructiove mindset of thugs who kiill more african americans every year there very own brothers.. Lets look at white suburbia in nassau county white neighborhoods there is more bars per square mile than anywhere in the world ..I agree Obama great speaker but he is not black man he is bi-racial ..he half white



I doubt benny likes the confederate flag considering it was republicans once again dying for peoples freedom we defeated the confederates.. we also passed the 1968 civil rights bill that racist southern dems opposed like gores father and robert kkk byrd .. :heythere

let me say this..

HAHHAAHA. your parties always been about freedom. HAHAHAHHAHAA

your trying to say the race riots in nyc, hung more people then ohhh i don't know the entire fucking south..

reaching at straws my main man. reaching.

[jameznyhc]

[QUOTE=jameznyhc;2523457]

let me say this..

HAHHAAHA. your parties always been about freedom. HAHAHAHHAHAA

your trying to say the race riots in nyc, hung more people then ohhh i don't know the entire fucking south..

reaching at straws my main man. reaching.

who was hanging blkacks in the south?? the dems and the kkk ... the republicans liberated blacks which is why they voted republican up until white liberals corrupted buy buying there votes with hand-outs in a time when it was tough for black folks to get work ..

[jameznyhc]

[QUOTE=jameznyhc;2523457]

let me say this..

HAHHAAHA. your parties always been about freedom. HAHAHAHHAHAA

your trying to say the race riots in nyc, hung more people then ohhh i don't know the entire fucking south..

reaching at straws my main man. reaching.

"The nation is at this time in a state of Revolution, North, South, East, and West," wrote the Washington Times during the often violent protests that occurred after Abraham Lincoln issued the March 3, 1863, Enrollment Act of Conscription. Although demonstrations took place in many Northern cities, the riots that broke out in New York City were both the most violent and the most publicized.
With a large and powerful Democratic party operating in the city, a dramatic show of dissent had been long in the making. The state's popular governor, Democrat Horatio Seymour, openly despised Lincoln and his policies. In addition, the Enrollment Act shocked a population already tired of the two-year-old war.
By the time the names of the first draftees were drawn in New York City on July 11, reports about the carnage of Gettysburg had been published in city papers. Lincoln's call for 300,000 more young men to fight a seemingly endless war frightened even those who supported the Union cause. Moreover, the Enrollment Act contained several exemptions, including the payment of a "commutation fee" that allowed wealthier and more influential citizens to buy their way out of service.
Perhaps no group was more resentful of these inequities than the Irish immigrants populating the slums of northeastern cities. Poor and more than a little prejudiced against blacks-with whom they were both unfamiliar and forced to compete for the lowest-paying jobs-the Irish in New York objected to fighting on their behalf.
On Sunday, June 12, the names of the draftees drawn the day before by the Provost Marshall were published in newspapers. Within hours, groups of irate citizens, many of them Irish immigrants, banded together across the city. Eventually numbering some 50,000 people, the mob terrorized neighborhoods on the East Side of New York for three days looting scores of stores. Blacks were the targets of most attacks on citizens; several lynchings and beatings occurred. In addition, a black church and orphanage were burned to the ground.
All in all, the mob caused more than $1.5 million of damage. The number killed or wounded during the riot is unknown, but estimates range from two dozen to nearly 100. Eventually, Lincoln deployed combat troops from the Federal Army of the Potomac to restore order; they remained encamped around the city for several weeks. In the end, the draft raised only about 150,000 troops throughout the North, about three-quarters of them substitutes, amounting to just one-fifth of the total Union force.

[Chris]

[QUOTE=Chris;2523483]

who was hanging blkacks in the south?? the dems and the kkk ... the republicans liberated blacks which is why they voted republican up until white liberals corrupted buy buying there votes with hand-outs in a time when it was tough for black folks to get work ..

lolol dude.. you just make up facts to support your theories. its so crazy its comical. im not even going to rebuke this one....

[Chris]

[QUOTE=Chris;2523483]

"The nation is at this time in a state of Revolution, North, South, East, and West," wrote the Washington Times during the often violent protests that occurred after Abraham Lincoln issued the March 3, 1863, Enrollment Act of Conscription. Although demonstrations took place in many Northern cities, the riots that broke out in New York City were both the most violent and the most publicized.
With a large and powerful Democratic party operating in the city, a dramatic show of dissent had been long in the making. The state's popular governor, Democrat Horatio Seymour, openly despised Lincoln and his policies. In addition, the Enrollment Act shocked a population already tired of the two-year-old war.
By the time the names of the first draftees were drawn in New York City on July 11, reports about the carnage of Gettysburg had been published in city papers. Lincoln's call for 300,000 more young men to fight a seemingly endless war frightened even those who supported the Union cause. Moreover, the Enrollment Act contained several exemptions, including the payment of a "commutation fee" that allowed wealthier and more influential citizens to buy their way out of service.
Perhaps no group was more resentful of these inequities than the Irish immigrants populating the slums of northeastern cities. Poor and more than a little prejudiced against blacks-with whom they were both unfamiliar and forced to compete for the lowest-paying jobs-the Irish in New York objected to fighting on their behalf.
On Sunday, June 12, the names of the draftees drawn the day before by the Provost Marshall were published in newspapers. Within hours, groups of irate citizens, many of them Irish immigrants, banded together across the city. Eventually numbering some 50,000 people, the mob terrorized neighborhoods on the East Side of New York for three days looting scores of stores. Blacks were the targets of most attacks on citizens; several lynchings and beatings occurred. In addition, a black church and orphanage were burned to the ground.
All in all, the mob caused more than $1.5 million of damage. The number killed or wounded during the riot is unknown, but estimates range from two dozen to nearly 100. Eventually, Lincoln deployed combat troops from the Federal Army of the Potomac to restore order; they remained encamped around the city for several weeks. In the end, the draft raised only about 150,000 troops throughout the North, about three-quarters of them substitutes, amounting to just one-fifth of the total Union force.
'

you are really brainwashed into think you need to blame a title label or group for the problems of the whole. thats whats so comical about all this, you rthihnk its the liberals fault for everything. right. the republican party basically never did well, if you look economically not one time but reagan did republicans do well for the economy and morale of this country. so you can toot your horn all day.. your a party of about 1.

[Chris]

more talk from the mind that doesn't know.......


uhm, afro-amer family was destroyed starting day one of slavery NOT from LBJ's policy.........then you jump from pre-60's to mid-80's......making a case when blacks were "good", as if to say they were prosperous, economically and socially, back then, riiiight...........and then you compare them to preset day FAMILIES migrating, you're obviously blind to the core problem which is the lack of a centered family, any immigrant family coming over pales in comparison to a single, family on welfare here....apples and oranges........and while you're comparing the caribbeans and africans, sorry bud, they're in the ghetto, too....not getting as near in prosperity as other immigrant groups

james, a lil tip.....end your racist statements while youre at it, and i know that gets you all flustered, but see, your comments, your assanine statistical nonsense, your "bringin home the bacon"....your lack of statistics on non-blacks on welfare.....just keeps proving why you fear Obama's victory :heythere

hee can talk all he wants hes never been in ear shot near a black person. i can bet money on it.

[jameznyhc]

hee can talk all he wants hes never been in ear shot near a black person. i can bet money on it.

of course cause your prejudice (to pre-judge) ..i went to IS27 blacks outnumbered whites ..my high school was split.. there was mad tensions during howard beach and bensinhurst incidents

[jameznyhc]

i ask every white person on this board to live for 1 week in a friends home in the ghetto.

IF you don't have a friends home to live in I would be kind enough to lend you a friend of mine. I want you to see the stark difference that goes on in your lilly white neighborhoods as opposed to darker ones. I am so sick of seeing people on this forum talk shit about which they know NOTHING about. its all lip service, all hear say, and all stuff they either read or was told NOT lived thru. please. I want people like

Benny, and Jamez to goto and spend time with ghetto people, go in a ghetto, go in a tenamant project housing, grow up around these people. funny thing i noticed about poor people they bond together more than their rich counterparts can ever ask for.... now please unles you been there. stfu...

put your money where your mouth is ..how much of your profits due you give the poor?? you allways say your family has money how much do you personally donate?? ..while your at it turn in your gun since guns are so bad ..you are a gun owner correct? ..why not give up your profitable business and run a non profit like republicans due to belive in cause your so passionate about .. i dont think that will happen ..youd rather do nothing have the govt confiscate other peoples money ..

[Chris]

of course cause your prejudice (to pre-judge) ..i went to IS27 blacks outnumbered whites ..my high school was split.. there was mad tensions during howard beach and bensinhurst incidents

ya there WAS tension. past tense.

[jameznyhc]

your point here?

asking a black person if their life was better when rudy was in office?

lets not live in the past, even if it was it has zero bearing on today. Right?

why do you want to live in the past about everything? everything is a bring back to a time that was but guess what it aint.. so why even talk about it?

Because this discussion can not be had without history..my point was LBJ great society(welfare, quotas, etc) VS. workfare ... even obama and bill clinton flipflopped due to rudys success.. So why dont you and donato tell me why welfare is beeter than workfare..

Love how dems say we live in the past .. lol rudy created workfare in 93 .. LBJ great society was mid 60s whose stuck in the past??

[jameznyhc]

Really, so my parents took away my drive and motivation by providing for me? lol

oh im discussing able bodied adults i had no idea your parents pay your rent, medical coverage, food, shopping, and going out money ..i thought you worked and had a job ..my bad ..you must have a real easy life im jealous

[jameznyhc]

LOL I read that book for one of my classes as well (well, more like footnotes/summary of it lol)

And let's call it what it is, he was clearly calling them lazy...Saying that someone will just sit on their ass and wait for everything to be handed to them is calling them LAZY. And he was calling white libs the "enablers."

Regardless of the programs u mentioned, if someone truly wants to be productive they will do better for themselves and not rely solely on gov't assistance. Implying that they have no desire to do so = calling them LAZY.

I would counter your argument with this point that your overlooking .. not all but the majority of hard working people who are the furthest thing from lazy do quit their jobs when they hit lottery ..and some still manage to piss it all away and go broke ..

is that girl you speak of an enabler of that loser 30 yr old man?? absolutly.. you all love to sound high and mighty but when it comes down to real life situations it and ill bring this up since mike brought it up himself in the business forum .. he evicting a piece of shit who fucked him over.. your advocating that girl should kivck the guy out .. chris and donato are totally prejudice by concluding that if your responsible and expect others to be your a racist ..yet chris wont hand in his gun or make his business non profitable to help the poor .. donato lives in the most republican boro..staten island is as republican as the south lol ..now theres nothing wrong with these points i brought up ..mike should evict, i agree with just like heaven , chris should own his gun and if donato chooses to live in a 90% republican community its his choice ..

[metfan85]

your point here?

asking a black person if their life was better when rudy was in office?

lets not live in the past, even if it was it has zero bearing on today. Right?

why do you want to live in the past about everything? everything is a bring back to a time that was but guess what it aint.. so why even talk about it?

weren't you talking about the slave trade just a few posts up? little contradictory no?

[ShaE]

oh im discussing able bodied adults i had no idea your parents pay your rent, medical coverage, food, shopping, and going out money ..i thought you worked and had a job ..my bad ..you must have a real easy life im jealous
I meant growing up jamez, not currently.:wallbang

My point was, providing for somebody, helping them, giving them a hand, doesn't have to lead to a demoralization of the person and degradation of their self esteem. LIke a caring parent can foster confidence and preparedness in a child, giving an adult who needs a hand, some help doesn't have to mean you've rendered them useless, lazy, and unmotivated to support themselves.

[JustLikeHeaven]

I would counter your argument with this point that your overlooking .. not all but the majority of hard working people who are the furthest thing from lazy do quit their jobs when they hit lottery ..and some still manage to piss it all away and go broke ..

is that girl you speak of an enabler of that loser 30 yr old man?? absolutly.. you all love to sound high and mighty but when it comes down to real life situations it and ill bring this up since mike brought it up himself in the business forum .. he evicting a piece of shit who fucked him over.. your advocating that girl should kivck the guy out .. chris and donato are totally prejudice by concluding that if your responsible and expect others to be your a racist ..yet chris wont hand in his gun or make his business non profitable to help the poor .. donato lives in the most republican boro..staten island is as republican as the south lol ..now theres nothing wrong with these points i brought up ..mike should evict, i agree with just like heaven , chris should own his gun and if donato chooses to live in a 90% republican community its his choice ..

How many times are we gonna revisit the 30 yr old man situation?? I already told u how I feel about that - he's a loser w/no drive or motivation. I don't believe in helping people who do nothing to help themselves, I never said I did.

[jameznyhc]

How many times are we gonna revisit the 30 yr old man situation?? I already told u how I feel about that - he's a loser w/no drive or motivation. I don't believe in helping people who do nothing to help themselves, I never said I did.

same principle he leeches off this girl .. the way welfare recipients leech off society.. he hs no drive because she an enabler

[jameznyhc]

I meant growing up jamez, not currently.:wallbang

My point was, providing for somebody, helping them, giving them a hand, doesn't have to lead to a demoralization of the person and degradation of their self esteem. LIke a caring parent can foster confidence and preparedness in a child, giving an adult who needs a hand, some help doesn't have to mean you've rendered them useless, lazy, and unmotivated to support themselves.

children are dependant because well there children .. now a parent can spoil one ..or inspire one .. im talking able bodied adults lol ..and i was being saracstic ..lol i know you work.. i know you moved outta howard beach ..

[ShaE]

children are dependant because well there children .. now a parent can spoil one ..or inspire one .. im talking able bodied adults lol ..and i was being saracstic ..lol i know you work.. i know you moved outta howard beach ..
I realize parenting a child is different than offering charity or help to an otherwise able-bodied grown adult. But the principle stands IMO, that help doesn't have to be enabling laziness. Not everybody is content to leech off another, but will accept help in dire circumstances.

People who have innate pride, know when to accept help and know when to use it to get back on their feet. People who don't have such pride, leech. I don't think gov't programs cause laziness, I think the people who use them allow themselves to become dependent and that's their own, or their parents' faults.

Nobody with any sense of work ethic would accept charity permanently, and I think that's what we need to work on here. Establishing that drive in people with tools, not elminating any source of aid they might get from the gov't.

[jameznyhc]

I realize parenting a child is different than offering charity or help to an otherwise able-bodied grown adult. But the principle stands IMO, that help doesn't have to be enabling laziness. Not everybody is content to leech off another, but will accept help in dire circumstances.

People who have innate pride, know when to accept help and know when to use it to get back on their feet. People who don't have such pride, leech. I don't think gov't programs cause laziness, I think the people who use them allow themselves to become dependent and that's their own, or their parents' faults.

Nobody with any sense of work ethic would accept charity permanently, and I think that's what we need to work on here. Establishing that drive in people with tools, not elminating any source of aid they might get from the gov't.

i agree .. should be temporary .. abuse and milking the system drives me crazy .. charity is great because your money is made better use off.. for instance id much rather give to charity than a tax hike thats going to be wasted ..and its my choice..

[ShaE]

i agree .. should be temporary .. abuse and milking the system drives me crazy .. charity is great because your money is made better use off.. for instance id much rather give to charity than a tax hike thats going to be wasted ..and its my choice..
help those who help themselves makes a lot of sense. this is why i support aid for college tuitions, or work programs, or things that are going to people who are attempting to better their situations. it kills me that people who are trying to raise themselves up have to fight against the cost of education or the rising costs of basic needs that get in the way. we have to make it simpler for people starting at a disadvantage to get a leg up, when they demonstrate that they want to.

how can poorer people save money and build themselves up if their savings is wiped out when they get sick for example? health costs are staggering. how can people get ahead?

[Chris]

weren't you talking about the slave trade just a few posts up? little contradictory no?

children.... come come now.

[Chris]

Because this discussion can not be had without history..my point was LBJ great society(welfare, quotas, etc) VS. workfare ... even obama and bill clinton flipflopped due to rudys success.. So why dont you and donato tell me why welfare is beeter than workfare..

Love how dems say we live in the past .. lol rudy created workfare in 93 .. LBJ great society was mid 60s whose stuck in the past??

little news flash.. um rudy did not have favor for the blacks i don't know what Rudy your talking about.

but i remember rudy with the bliue wall of silence cops with unsurmountable power and how many people where shot in black neighborhoods that went un touched while he was around?

Abna louima? All this stuff is forgotten? come on.. all you republicans cherry pick your topics, and say ok its good to use this for now, but later we can't use this point cause it don't coincide to what we speak of.

[jameznyhc]

little news flash.. um rudy did not have favor for the blacks i don't know what Rudy your talking about.

but i remember rudy with the bliue wall of silence cops with unsurmountable power and how many people where shot in black neighborhoods that went un touched while he was around?

Abna louima? All this stuff is forgotten? come on.. all you republicans cherry pick your topics, and say ok its good to use this for now, but later we can't use this point cause it don't coincide to what we speak of.

he reduced the murder rate in the ghetto by from 2200 per year under dinkins to 600 per year ..he helped and gave workfare skills he reduced welfare from 1.2 million to 360,000 people.. he cleaned up the streets ..I remeber abmna luima of course .. and yes Rudy stood up for the police .. i dont think they murderd the man.. cops just shot a white guy on staten island 10 times ..you wont hear a peep ..this happende 3 days ago i believe ..sharpton exploits those situations for personal gain ..thats why he rich as fuck and lives in tea neck nj .. making money off the communtiy by playing racial poltics